1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

Discuss releases by Criterion and the films on them. Threads may contain spoilers!
Message
Author
User avatar
yoloswegmaster
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 3:57 pm

Re: Forthcoming: Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#51 Post by yoloswegmaster » Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:18 pm

Ribs wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:16 pm
Thank god they were able to get a new subtitle translation
Was there something wrong with the old one?

User avatar
domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#52 Post by domino harvey » Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:30 pm

I mean, they still are keeping the inaccurate translation for the title, so

User avatar
The Elegant Dandy Fop
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2004 3:25 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#53 Post by The Elegant Dandy Fop » Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:48 pm

domino harvey wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:30 pm
I mean, they still are keeping the inaccurate translation for the title, so
Something I noticed too.

It seems like contemporary cinema of the last few years keeps letting me down, but this film lives up to all the praise already expressed on here. Very excited to see this enter the collection.

User avatar
domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#54 Post by domino harvey » Wed Mar 18, 2020 4:54 pm

I 100% think it's because the distros were aware of the debate among the film's core audience in the states about the perceived ills of using the word "girl" to refer to women (and I'll save those of you who haven't figured it out already from Googling: the accurate translation would be "Portrait of the Young Girl on Fire")

User avatar
senseabove
Joined: Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:07 am

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#55 Post by senseabove » Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:05 pm

Wouldn't it also be "the" instead of "a"? Definite/indefinite doesn't always map strictly to the/a in going from French to English, but a quick googling and I can't find any actual portraits with a title that use "le" instead of "une," so its seems like it must have been a considered choice by Sciamma...

I just assumed the English title was also going for the pre-existing loose familiarity of the phrase "Portrait of a Lady"...

User avatar
domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#56 Post by domino harvey » Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:09 pm

Yes, you're right, I was misremembering "une" instead of "la"-- I guess I shouldn't have saved myself a Google! Fixed in my previous post now

User avatar
Never Cursed
Such is life on board the Redoutable
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 12:22 am

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#57 Post by Never Cursed » Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:15 pm

This reminds me of a question I had to our French-speaking members: the English title of this film (however mistranslated) doesn't grammatically specify if it is the portrait or the young lady that is on fire (both are not inaccurate per the events of the film), but does the French title?

User avatar
soundchaser
Leave Her to Beaver
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:32 am

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#58 Post by soundchaser » Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:20 pm

Never Cursed wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:15 pm
This reminds me of a question I had to our French-speaking members: the English title of this film (however mistranslated) doesn't grammatically specify if it is the portrait or the young lady that is on fire (both are not inaccurate per the events of the film), but does the French title?
Nope - "en feu," the part in question, is a genderless prepositional phrase that could apply to either subject. Basically the same structure as in English. If the "on fire" bit were an adjective like "burning" or "aflame" we would know, since "portrait" is a masculine noun, but no such luck.

User avatar
swo17
Bloodthirsty Butcher
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:25 am
Location: SLC, UT

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#59 Post by swo17 » Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:21 pm

Better that way

User avatar
soundchaser
Leave Her to Beaver
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:32 am

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#60 Post by soundchaser » Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:21 pm

I don't disagree. :)

User avatar
furbicide
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2011 4:52 am

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#61 Post by furbicide » Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:28 pm

Love the cover! Can't wait to see this one again. (Also, interesting discussion above about the title – I was aware of the mistranslation, but the double meaning had never occurred to me!)

User avatar
Ribs
Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2014 1:14 pm

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#62 Post by Ribs » Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:42 pm

But I would also bear in mind that Celine Sciamma speaks fluent English and the movie’s English-language title has always been Portrait of a Lady on Fire since before the movie premiered and was acquired at Cannes. So it’s not really a mistranslation anymore than Pan’s Labyrinth is - it’s lightly changed to carry the meaning a little cleaner

Rupert Pupkin
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 9:34 am

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#63 Post by Rupert Pupkin » Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:16 am

soundchaser wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:20 pm
Never Cursed wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 5:15 pm
This reminds me of a question I had to our French-speaking members: the English title of this film (however mistranslated) doesn't grammatically specify if it is the portrait or the young lady that is on fire (both are not inaccurate per the events of the film), but does the French title?
Nope - "en feu," the part in question, is a genderless prepositional phrase that could apply to either subject. Basically the same structure as in English. If the "on fire" bit were an adjective like "burning" or "aflame" we would know, since "portrait" is a masculine noun, but no such luck.
"Portrait de la jeune fille en feu" (I'm french (sorry :oops: ) so I will give you that I never thought about the easy-second subtext of the "fille en feu". To me the title like the English-translated title refers to the fire scene. Even before I saw the movie I did not think about the second sense/subtext (which is the same in English)- "she's on fire" and however, I'm a pervert.- in French, you rather say "elle a le feu au cul" vulgar to say the least.
I think that "Lady" was chosen because in the French dialogue of the movie, when the maid adresses or when they refer to Adel Haenel character, since this is a "film d'époque"; "Lady" was chosen in English because of Adel Haenel social "status" in this movie.
In French, I think that "jeune fille ne feu" works better, because she is still a "jeune fille" (coming out from the "covent"/"couvent) before this arranged marriage vs the character played by Noémie Merlant who obviously due to her profession of woman painter have more freedom but had to pay the price for it (there are some scenes which explains that although she is recognized as a painter she signed some painting (the Orphée painting with the signature of her father, and could not paint some men), etc...)

I remember that Kieslowski who asked help for the French dialogues for "La double vie de Véronique" choose different titles and was aware that "Véronique" (but he like this prénom and I totally agree it's a beautiful name). "Véronique" -> "Véro nique" which means Véro fucks. (same for the song "c'est Thérèse qui rit quand on la..." But he kept it and he was right.

by the way, the painting for the Criterion-cover is certainly done by Hélène Delmaire and was probably one of the unused suggested portrait for the movie - but I could be wrong.

I enjoy that Adel Hanel and Mlle Merlant have been interviewed by the Criterion collection. I think that Noémie Merlant is mesmerizing in this movie (her expressive dark eyes :shock: :oops: -. I rewatched by incident "Un moment d'égarement" by Jean François Richet and was totally in crush-state like François Cluzet - she plays a crépière in this movie. A very short role, but "remarquable" role.
Of course I saw her recently in "Curiosia"

User avatar
MichaelB
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 6:20 pm
Location: Worthing
Contact:

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#64 Post by MichaelB » Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:02 am

Rupert Pupkin wrote:by the way, the painting for the Criterion-cover is certainly done by Hélène Delmaire and was probably one of the unused suggested portrait for the movie - but I could be wrong.
One of the things that most impressed me about the film is the way that the paintings actually worked in context. I remember Michael Powell saying (and he was right) that he was never happy with the paintings in Age of Consent, which he envisaged as being far more luxuriantly sensual, but only realised that he’d hired the wrong guy when it was too late to do anything about it.

Rupert Pupkin
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2005 9:34 am

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#65 Post by Rupert Pupkin » Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:28 am

MichaelB wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:02 am
Rupert Pupkin wrote:by the way, the painting for the Criterion-cover is certainly done by Hélène Delmaire and was probably one of the unused suggested portrait for the movie - but I could be wrong.
One of the things that most impressed me about the film is the way that the paintings actually worked in context. I remember Michael Powell saying (and he was right) that he was never happy with the paintings in Age of Consent, which he envisaged as being far more luxuriantly sensual, but only realised that he’d hired the wrong guy when it was too late to do anything about it.
one of the thing about this movie I really enjoyed was that it shows the painting process - I don't know if the close-ups on Noémie Merlant are really Noémie's hands or if they choose a painter like in "La Belle Noiseuse" by JJ Rivette (these are not Michel Piccoli's hands). Even all these scene with Emmanuelle Béart and all these close-up on the book were we see the nervous hands trying some sketches are not Piccoli's hands. The editing is well done but somehow it annoyed me to know that.
This is not the same story; but just on the perspective of a movie about painting (and Portrait like La Belle Noiseuse are both far more than just that) to me "Le Portrait de la jeune fille en feh" shows much more the painting process : watching the model
SpoilerShow
(there's the first part and the second part of the movie when Adèle Haenel's character is "aware" and consent to be painted)
, painting, sketches, etc...
SpoilerShow
(especially with the plot that Noémie is supposed to "catch" Adèle Haenel's face and portrait in secret)
for me Sciamma's movie is one of the best movie I have ever seen about the "painting process".

User avatar
domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#66 Post by domino harvey » Mon Mar 30, 2020 3:18 pm

For those who understand French, the French Blu-ray has a commentary with the director, cinematographer, and two stars

User avatar
swo17
Bloodthirsty Butcher
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:25 am
Location: SLC, UT

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#67 Post by swo17 » Mon Mar 30, 2020 3:23 pm

I was interested to notice the other day that this has made it to the IMDb Top 250

User avatar
DarkImbecile
Ask me about my visible cat breasts
Joined: Mon Dec 09, 2013 6:24 pm
Location: Albuquerque, NM

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#68 Post by DarkImbecile » Mon Mar 30, 2020 3:27 pm

My 6562 burner accounts are finally paying off

User avatar
FrauBlucher
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2013 8:28 pm
Location: Greenwich Village

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#69 Post by FrauBlucher » Sat May 16, 2020 3:07 pm


User avatar
TMDaines
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:01 pm
Location: Stretford, Manchester

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#70 Post by TMDaines » Sat May 16, 2020 6:19 pm

Ooo I wasn’t ready for that 28 at the end. Bottom lip wobbled.

Sciamma surely belongs as one of the elite filmmakers in the world at this point. Can’t wait to see what see does next.

User avatar
senseabove
Joined: Wed Dec 02, 2015 3:07 am

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#71 Post by senseabove » Sun Jun 07, 2020 2:24 pm

domino harvey wrote:
Mon Mar 30, 2020 3:18 pm
For those who understand French, the French Blu-ray has a commentary with the director, cinematographer, and two stars
And for those who don't, reports from That Other Forum are that Artificial Eye licensed and subtitled this commentary on their UK release.

User avatar
Caligula
Carthago delenda est
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 2:32 am
Location: George, South Africa

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#72 Post by Caligula » Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:52 am

Audio Commentary with director Céline Sciamma, actors Adèle Haenel and Noémie Merlant, and cinematographer Claire Mathon
"Paintings by Hélène Delmaire" documentary (55:07)
Interview from 2019 with artist Hélène Delmaire on creating the paintings for the film (11:51)
Trailer (1:58)
Think I'll rather go for the AE

User avatar
MichaelB
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 6:20 pm
Location: Worthing
Contact:

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#73 Post by MichaelB » Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:59 am

Yes, Artificial Eye looks like a clear winner here in terms of quality over quantity. And I assume the main feature source is the same digital master that Criterion used - for such a recent film, why would there be more than one?

User avatar
domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#74 Post by domino harvey » Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:55 pm

Since there’s only one overlapping extra, super-fans could pick up both with few concerns if they wanted the whole kit’s worth

andsoitgoes
Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2020 6:18 pm

Re: 1034 Portrait of a Lady on Fire

#75 Post by andsoitgoes » Thu Jun 11, 2020 11:15 pm

MichaelB wrote:
Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:59 am
Yes, Artificial Eye looks like a clear winner here in terms of quality over quantity. And I assume the main feature source is the same digital master that Criterion used - for such a recent film, why would there be more than one?
Hi all, cane here to try and find some information out, don’t know why I didn’t join sooner.

Anyone know if AE are region free? I want to support criterion, but I’m ALLLL about commentary tracks!

Post Reply