942 The Tree of Life
- knives
- Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:49 pm
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
One featuring a series of crimes against humanity and the other with a nice Morricone score.
- Noiretirc
- Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2008 6:04 pm
- Location: VanIsle
- Contact:
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
The fact that Criterion basically produced this is huge news for me. This has to be classified as a rather big project with Malick, right? I cannot visualize Malick carelessly slapping 50mins together. I wonder if we will see similar new editions of Malick films post Tree Of Life.DarkImbecile wrote:According to the press around it, this cut was put together for the first time and financed by Criterion, so no one's seen it in this form.
- What A Disgrace
- Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 10:34 pm
- Contact:
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Perhaps I am crazy, but I think I will wait for the hopefully inevitable 4K Edition.
- zedz
- Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 7:24 pm
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Maybe in the new cut Malick removed Sean Penn's ten minutes from the original movie and replaced it with humpback whales humping.pzadvance wrote:Variety said the new cut was 179 minutes, and Criterion now says the new cut has 50 additional minutes added to the 139-minute theatrical runtime...
So, whose math do we think was off?
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Is it too unkind to say that would be an improvement?
- whaleallright
- Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 12:56 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Wow, Criterion just posted a few minutes of exclusive footage from the new cut!: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuaOYz4YTN8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- zedz
- Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 7:24 pm
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Was that Sean Penn coming out of the egg?whaleallright wrote:Wow, Criterion just posted a few minutes of exclusive footage from the new cut!: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuaOYz4YTN8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- domino harvey
- Dot Com Dom
- Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
I didn't care for this film, but I'm willing to give a longer cut a chance-- I think it's possible that the big lack I felt the first time could conceivably be filled-in by more material
- Brian C
- I hate to be That Pedantic Guy but...
- Joined: Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:58 am
- Location: Chicago, IL
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Huh, not what I expected ... when the promo materials said "no additional effects shots", I just assumed it was 50 minutes of Sean Penn reading his poetry.whaleallright wrote:Wow, Criterion just posted a few minutes of exclusive footage from the new cut!: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuaOYz4YTN8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- Noiretirc
- Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2008 6:04 pm
- Location: VanIsle
- Contact:
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
It's strange how Penn in this film is the subject of many jokes. Because, even though I have not seen this film in over two years, I remember Penn in a powerful albeit understated and quiet role. When I recall The Tree Of Life, Penn is upfront in my memories.
Strange, huh?
Strange, huh?
- dda1996a
- Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:14 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Not really. I mean he's third in my sequences preference, as everything in the 50 is perfect and Genesis is also beautiful. But I rather like it. Penn's parts were also Malick's first modern short pieces, which back then was both new and eye-opening. I still love the shit out of this film so excited for even more footage. Shame this is the last Malick I like
- tenia
- Ask Me About My Bassoon
- Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:13 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
The Tree of Life is one of the new movies that moved me most these past 10 years, so I'm all for 50 more minutes.
- Lost Highway
- Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:41 am
- Location: Berlin, Germany
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
It’s probably a question of sensibility but as someone who runs a mile from anybody who waffles on about being “spiritual” this movie was like getting beaten to death with a rolled up yoga mat as far as I’m concerned.
- tenia
- Ask Me About My Bassoon
- Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:13 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Outside of any spiritual consideration, I thought it was a very moving poetic take on forgivingness. And as a whole, while I'm not very fond of heavy spiritual movies either (though seemingly not as much as you), I found plenty to like outside this area. But I suppose it's a typically YMMV zone.
- dda1996a
- Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:14 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
I think there's a bid difference between those pseudo spirituals (and Malick reached that level with everything post ToL) and trying to express the ineffable using cinema. I'm a sucker just for those beautiful small moments of childhood memories, that Malick goes the extra mile and attempts to tie everything together (death, nature vs nurture, the whole fricking universe being made as a way to understand and cope with our little life) but does so through sound and image.Lost Highway wrote:It’s probably a question of sensibility but as someone who runs a mile from anybody who waffles on about being “spiritual” this movie was like getting beaten to death with a rolled up yoga mat as far as I’m concerned.
Do you also not like Dreyer, Tarkovsky, Angelopoulos and Kieslowski?
- tenia
- Ask Me About My Bassoon
- Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:13 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
To be exact, ToL has more, to me, to be linked with classical philosophy themes than spirituality, the most obvious exemple to me being the hard working father working on big modern noisy things vs the nurturing nature-loving calming mother.
All these small things moved me a lot. The way Malick represents the arrival of a child in a family, coping with death, the way the children see their mother as some kind of goddess.
Maybe it's spiritual, I guess, but not directly a discussion over God, more how to see one's life, one's actions. It's, in a way, not very different from what tons and tons of artists have been discussing for centuries.
All these small things moved me a lot. The way Malick represents the arrival of a child in a family, coping with death, the way the children see their mother as some kind of goddess.
Maybe it's spiritual, I guess, but not directly a discussion over God, more how to see one's life, one's actions. It's, in a way, not very different from what tons and tons of artists have been discussing for centuries.
- dda1996a
- Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:14 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
I agree with you, but it depends on each person's definition of spirituality. That's why I said this isn't pseudo, like Point Break or Revenant (I think the Revenant is a good counterpoint, as that film tries hard to reach Malick profoundness but fails)tenia wrote:To be exact, ToL has more, to me, to be linked with classical philosophy themes than spirituality, the most obvious exemple to me being the hard working father working on big modern noisy things vs the nurturing nature-loving calming mother.
All these small things moved me a lot. The way Malick represents the arrival of a child in a family, coping with death, the way the children see their mother as some kind of goddess.
Maybe it's spiritual, I guess, but not directly a discussion over God, more how to see one's life, one's actions. It's, in a way, not very different from what tons and tons of artists have been discussing for centuries.
- FrauBlucher
- Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2013 8:28 pm
- Location: Greenwich Village
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Sean Penn was in this film? Must've missed it.Noiretirc wrote:It's strange how Penn in this film is the subject of many jokes. Because, even though I have not seen this film in over two years, I remember Penn in a powerful albeit understated and quiet role. When I recall The Tree Of Life, Penn is upfront in my memories.
Strange, huh?
- Lost Highway
- Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:41 am
- Location: Berlin, Germany
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
I loved all of that in Badlands and Days of Heaven, the latter I count as one of my favourite films. But in those film the nature imagery, the interconnectedness was in the service of a drama which I found compelling. Once Malick reduced everything to his directorial flourishes in search for The Meaning of Life, his films lost me. It’s exactly these ideas of everything being interconnected which I have no use for. It’s stoner mysticism at best for me.dda1996a wrote:I think there's a bid difference between those pseudo spirituals (and Malick reached that level with everything post ToL) and trying to express the ineffable using cinema. I'm a sucker just for those beautiful small moments of childhood memories, that Malick goes the extra mile and attempts to tie everything together (death, nature vs nurture, the whole fricking universe being made as a way to understand and cope with our little life) but does so through sound and image.Lost Highway wrote:It’s probably a question of sensibility but as someone who runs a mile from anybody who waffles on about being “spiritual” this movie was like getting beaten to death with a rolled up yoga mat as far as I’m concerned.
Do you also not like Dreyer, Tarkovsky, Angelopoulos and Kieslowski?
The closest to that type of thing I respond to in drama would be Thornton Wilder‘s Our Town. While often mistaken for being folksy and twee, its view of the universe and our place in it, is far closer to my heart. Tree of Life suggests that in the interconnectedness of all things on earth there is something bigger than us. It suggests a sort of Heaven. That veers too close to religion and spirituality for me and it doesn’t connect with me. Thornton Wilder says, this is all there is. His afterlife isn’t to be taken literally, it’s a dramatic device to reflect on the short time we have on earth. The meaning is in the everyday and that’s pretty much it. No larger purpose, no god, no reconciliations in the afterlife.
I like Dreyer but you are indeed right that I don’t connect with the other directors you‘ve mentioned. I’ve only seen one Angelopoulos which didn’t do much for me and Tarkovsky‘s and Kieslowski‘s mysticism and spirituality run pretty much contrary to my sensibilities. You can add Bresson as well. Give me the humanism of Truffaut, the politics of Fassbinder, the satire of political and religious institutions of Buñuel, the romantic cynicism of Hitchcock and the surreal anarchy of Lynch instead. They are the filmmakers I feel philosophically closest to.
- dda1996a
- Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:14 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
I guess you answered it yourself,so there really isn't much to go off from here. I'm just more of an inquisitive person, so just raising questions and leaving them open for me to think is usually what I find most illuminating. Hence my deep devotion to those directors I mentioned
- Lost Highway
- Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:41 am
- Location: Berlin, Germany
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
I didn’t pose a question. I answered you, so I don’t understand the first sentence.dda1996a wrote:I guess you answered it yourself,so there really isn't much to go off from here. I'm just more of an inquisitive person, so just raising questions and leaving them open for me to think is usually what I find most illuminating. Hence my deep devotion to those directors I mentioned
I don’t know why preferring some filmmakers to others makes me less of an inquisitive person. All of the directors I’ve mentioned have made films which leave questions at the end. My inquiries just have more to do with moral, scientific, ethical and political conundrums than with spirituality or religion, which as an atheist I reject. That doesn’t mean I’m not curious about our place in the world.
- whaleallright
- Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 12:56 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
I think Tree of Life is pretty evenly split between startlingly vivid evocations of private moments and clichéd imagery that just fails on a visceral level (and it comes pretty thick in the latter part of the film). when I first saw it, I focused on the latter and really disliked it. subsequent viewings made me appreciate it much more, but I don't think I'll ever be anything other than divided on its merits.
I have no idea what this has to do with Dreyer who to my knowledge never used a single visual cliché in his work. his films work powerfully as human dramas, not as allegories or statements or "spiritual" musings.
I hate the mystification that often goes on regarding "spiritual" directors. Paul Schrader has a lot to answer for.
I have no idea what this has to do with Dreyer who to my knowledge never used a single visual cliché in his work. his films work powerfully as human dramas, not as allegories or statements or "spiritual" musings.
I hate the mystification that often goes on regarding "spiritual" directors. Paul Schrader has a lot to answer for.
- The Pachyderminator
- Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2017 9:24 pm
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Personally, I do find the drama in Tree of Life compelling. I think Jack seems like a very real and empathetic person, not least in his inchoate search for transcendence of mortality and "the meaning of life" - and, importantly, I think this search makes compelling drama even if materialist and/or atheist philosophy is true. It could be that the spiritual quest is inherently futile and tragic, and it's certainly true that it very easily shades into fanaticism on the one hand and a vague pseudo-religious aetheticism on the other. But either way, it seems to be very deeply rooted in human nature. I'd hate to think that being an atheist means one can't appreciate this drama. (This is not to say that Lost Highway said that, or that there's anything wrong at all with preferring cinema that focuses on more worldly issues.)
I'd agree that the most "literal" parts are the least effective. The part where people are strolling around on an anonymous tidal flat has never done much for me, either now or when I first saw the film as an impressionable 20-year-old. The film best shows God (or what you will) by finding new ways to look at the beauty of creation. The same is true of, say, Kieslowski, as his reputation for brilliant close-ups suggests. I think the Three Colors trilogy is spiritually powerful, but it achieves this power by looking closely at things in the world. Almost anything will do, even a sugar cube dissolving in coffee or (in Decalogue 2, if memory serves) a fly on the wall.
I'd agree that the most "literal" parts are the least effective. The part where people are strolling around on an anonymous tidal flat has never done much for me, either now or when I first saw the film as an impressionable 20-year-old. The film best shows God (or what you will) by finding new ways to look at the beauty of creation. The same is true of, say, Kieslowski, as his reputation for brilliant close-ups suggests. I think the Three Colors trilogy is spiritually powerful, but it achieves this power by looking closely at things in the world. Almost anything will do, even a sugar cube dissolving in coffee or (in Decalogue 2, if memory serves) a fly on the wall.
- dda1996a
- Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 6:14 am
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
I meant it as there wasn't much to go on, we'll just agree we have different tastes (even though I like all the directors you mentioned). I meant inquisitive in the sense that I find questions a lot more interesting than getting answers. Hence why the voice-over in Thin Red Line-ToL (from To the Wonder they do reach cliche levels) never bothered me as they made me swoon.
I don't think anyone can watch Order, Day of Wrath or most of all Joan of Arc without mentioning spirituality. I evoked directors who personally are on that spectrum, that of religion and spirituality. Say what you will but I consider his films nothing but religious works of art
I don't think anyone can watch Order, Day of Wrath or most of all Joan of Arc without mentioning spirituality. I evoked directors who personally are on that spectrum, that of religion and spirituality. Say what you will but I consider his films nothing but religious works of art
- Michael Kerpan
- Spelling Bee Champeen
- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
- Location: New England
- Contact:
Re: 942 The Tree of Life
Indeed.whaleallright wrote:I hate the mystification that often goes on regarding "spiritual" directors. Paul Schrader has a lot to answer for.